Български > Дискусии
Помаците - какви са били ?
Turas:
--- Quote from: Rahmie on February 04, 2012, 18:02 ---100 stranici i kakiv e verniyat otgovor... ::) :)
--- End quote ---
Помаците са Траки. Родопските помаци са от тракийското племе беси. Почитали са Дионисус. Свещен град - Пере, с глвно светилище - Сива!
Marlboro:
Nikoga ne e imalo" traki" tova sa bili razlichni plemena v razlichni epohi narecheni "trakijci" sled kato e zavladqn regiona Trakiq ot makedoncite Filip 2-ri. Imeto na regiona idva ot sina na bog Ares izvesten kato Thrax http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thracians
Bessi
През 72 г. пр.н.е., проконсулa на Македония Марк Терентиус Varro Лycullus побеждава бесите в Тракия. пo kъсно Страбон gi spomenava v записkite si, kato бесите sa наj свирепиte ot независимите тракийски племена, около Хемус planinskata veriga , нарича ги разбойници сред разбойници и че те са пристрастени към грабеж.
In 72 BC, the proconsul of Macedonia Marcus Terentius Varro Lucullus defeated the Bessi in Thrace. Later Strabo, provides a record in which the Bessi are described as the fiercest of the independent Thracian tribes, dwelling on and around the Haemus range, and possessing the greater part of the area around that mountain chain.He calls them brigands among brigands and that they were addicted to plunder.The capital of the Bessi was Uscudama now Edirne in modern Turkey.
One of the many locations of the Bessi
The Diobesi are thought to be a union of sorts between the Besai and the Dii. Pliny the Elder reveals that there were several divisions of the Bessi
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bessi
Bryges
Bryges is the historical name given to a people of the ancient Balkans. They are generally considered to have been related to the Phrygians, who during classical antiquity lived in western Anatolia. Both names, Bryges and Phrygians, are assumed to be variants of the same root. Based on archaeological evidence, some scholars (e.g., Nicholas Hammond, Eugene N. Borza et al.) argue that the Bryges/Phrygians were members of the Lusatian culture that migrated into the southern Balkans during the Late Bronze Age. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bryges
Lusatian culture
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lusatian_culture
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/58/KulturaLuzycka_1.png/300px-KulturaLuzycka_1.png
Phrygians
The Phrygians were an ancient Indo-European people, initially dwelling in the southern Balkans; according to Herodotus, under the name of Bryges , changing it to Phruges after their final migration to Anatolia, via the Hellespont.
From tribal and village beginnings, the state of Phrygia arose in the 8th century BC with its capital at Gordium http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phrygians
Gordium
Gordium was the capital city of ancient Phrygia. It was located at the site of modern Yassıhüyük, about 70–80 km southwest of Ankara (capital of Turkey)
In the twelfth century BCE, Gordium was settled by Thracians who had migrated from southeastern Europe. During the ninth and eighth centuries (BC), the city grew into the capital of a kingdom that controlled much of Asia Minor west of the river Halys. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gordium
Bithyni
The Bithyni were a Thracian tribe who, along with the Thyni, migrated to Bithynia in Anatolia - a region which they gave their name to. Herodotus, Xenophon and Strabo all assert that the Bithyni and Thyni settled together in what would be known as Bithynia and Thynia. According to Herodotus, the Bithynian Thracians originally lived along the Strymon river, and were known as Strymonians http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bithyni
Thyni
The Thyni were a Thracian tribe who, along with the Bithyni, migrated to the lands that would later be known as Thynia and Bithynia in Anatolia. Each respective region got its name, presumably, from the Thracian tribe that was more prominent in the area.
Marlboro:
Mysians
Their first mention is by Homer, in his list of Trojans allies in the Iliad, and according to whom the Mysians fought in the Trojan War on the side of Troy, under the command of Chromis and Ennomus the Auger, and were lion-hearted spearmen who fought with their bare hands
Herodotus in his Histories wrote that the Mysians were brethren of the Carians and the Lydians, originally Lydian colonists in their country, and as such, they had the right to worship alongside their relative nations in the sanctuary dedicated to the Carian Zeus in Mylasa.[2] He also mentions a movement of Mysians and associated peoples from Asia into Europe still earlier than the Trojan War, wherein the Mysians and Teucrians had crossed the Bosphorus into Europe and, after conquering all of Thrace, pressed forward till they came to the Ionian Sea, while southward they reached as far as the river Peneus.[3] Herodotus adds an account and description of later Mysians who fought in Darius' army.
Little is known about the Mysian language. Strabo noted that their language was, in a way, a mixture of the Lydian and Phrygian languages. As such, the Mysian language could be a language of the Anatolian group. However, a passage in Athenaeus suggests that the Mysian language was akin to the barely attested Paeonian language of Paeonia, north of Macedon.
A short inscription which could be in Mysian and which dates from between the 5th and 3rd centuries BC was found in Uyuçik, near Kütahya, and seems to include Indo-European words, but it has not been deciphered
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mysians
Paeonians
Origin
Yet according to the national legend (Herodotus v. 13), they were Teucrian colonists from Troy. Homer (Iliad, book II, line 848) speaks of Paeonians from the Axios fighting on the side of the Trojans, but the Iliad does not mention whether the Paeonians were kin to the Trojans. Homer gives the Paeonian leader as a certain Pyraechmes (parentage unknown); but later on in the Iliad (Book 21)Homer mentions a second leader, named Asteropaeus, son of Pelagon.
Before the reign of Darius Hystaspes, they had made their way as far east as Perinthus in Thrace on the Propontis. At one time all Mygdonia, together with Crestonia, was subject to them. When Xerxes crossed Chalcidice on his way to Therma (later renamed Thessalonica) he is said to have marched through Paeonian territory. They occupied the entire valley of the Axios (Vardar) as far inland as Stobi, the valleys to the east of it as far as the Strymon and the country round Astibus and the river of the same name, with the water of which they anointed their kings.
The Paeonian tribes were:
Agrianes[2] (also, Agriani and Agrii)
Almopians[3] (also Almopioi)
Laeaeans[4] (also Laeaei and Laiai)
Derrones[5] (also Derroni)
Odomantes[6] (also Odomanti)
Paeoplae[7]
Doberes[8]
Siropaiones[9]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paeonia_%28kingdom%29
Kakto se vijda v tezi linkove "trakijcte" sa naj razlichni narodi i plemena prishalci (v regiona Trakiq ) ot razlichni vremena.
Сидхарта:
--- Quote from: Вологез on February 04, 2012, 18:20 ---Помаците са Траки. Родопските помаци са от тракийското племе беси. Почитали са Дионисус. Свещен град - Пере, с глвно светилище - Сива!
--- End quote ---
Вожде, твърде лесно реши задачата.
Може, даже твърде е възможно, тракииска кръв да тече във вените на родопчани, но тя не ще да е единствената.
Между античноста и нашето време, различни етнически групи са прониквали и са се настанявали на територията на Родопа планина.
Като прибавим и миграциите на населението не само през средновековието ,но и по време на османското владичество ,задачата става не толкова лесна за решаване.
Да се идентифицира дадена група от населението на балканите днес само с един етнос, ще бъде абсолютно невярно твърдение.
Turas:
Доминращият ген е тракийски! ;) Бесите идват от Сибир и се заселват в Родопите 4200 г. преди Христа. Тук по това време има и местно население (виж. неолитни селища в Родопите). Едно такова селище е неолитно селище Ракитово, датирано от 6000 г. преди Христа (артефактите са изложени в Пазарджишки исторически музей). Естествено, че е имало смесване, но не е в такива размери, както се опитват да го изкарат някой ''историци''. Дори в днешния динамичен живот наблюдава ли се такова смесване? Смесване е имало, но само между сродни племена. Няма сведения беси да са се смесвали с араби, негри, индийци или китайци! :D
http://www.pomak.eu/board/index.php?topic=4598.0
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